Levels in Gunz

[Dimeq]

Levels in Gunz are pointless because Gunz is a skill-based game and not a MMORPG. Unless the level system were changed dramatically (get killed=lose one level, kill=gain a level; no maximum level), it only reflects how much time a player spent on the game and not on their skill.

Discuss.

[GhaxX]

/care ¬_¬

You can unlock new stuff and harder quests etc with levels and levels make it more interesting.

Without levels many players would have quit long time ago.

Also you know that Lv50 is obviously better than 95-98% of Lv1-10 in beginner channel (those few percent are those with a higher Lv'ed character) so you can divide them into different channels

[SomeGuy]

lvls are important, it seperates characters into channels with the beginners, veterans,expert,elite

[meandme]

lvls makes how skilled they actually are not the stat points if u want stat points go to some RPG crap,
lvl 1 would get owned by lvl 10 because lvl 10 has more expierence,
and it differs the weapons as well

[birdy95464]

what does it matter.

[Neiliomedeilio]

More equiptable items, page 65 quest, all that good stuff.

[MegamanExE]

Leveling is what keeps people playing the game. If there weren't any lvls I probably wouldn't be playin.
Lvling is what makes the players play to get better weapons. W/o leveling this game would be like MoH.
Everyone would have the same equips and everyone would have the same weps... No fun....

[D33R]

ijji need to start make more weapons for level 30+ =P ( it will make it fun imo)

[skeetskeet]

I disagree, levels make the game great. why u wanna just play and not be rewarded with anything :confused:

As a great gunz player(me) once said, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT DONT PLAY IT

[SomeGuy]

When the 50s 60s and 70s right now start reaching around 70s 80s and 90s ijji definatly should get more bounty items then lvls will matter a lot.

[Dimeq]

Skipped some repetitive responses.

You can unlock new stuff and harder quests etc with levels and levels make it more interesting.

You unlock new armor/weapons, yes, but why aren't they unlocked from the beginning? The only point to it is to have players think that they're somehow superior to lower-leveled players; it doesn't make the game more interesting or anything. Maybe a suggestion would be to only enable showing levels on quest servers, which is the only place where levels would make sense. (levels in order to unlock more harder versions of quest which give items that look cool.)

Without levels many players would have quit long time ago.

It doesn't make the game more interesting to be at a higher level. Why would they have quit without a leveling system?

Also you know that Lv50 is obviously better than 95-98% of Lv1-10 in beginner channel (those few percent are those with a higher Lv'ed character) so you can divide them into different channels

Then there only needs to be two different channels: newbie/regular players. Any other channels are pointless because the game is about skill; after around level 20, level doesn't tell anything about skill.

lvls makes how skilled they actually are not the stat points if u want stat points go to some RPG crap,
lvl 1 would get owned by lvl 10 because lvl 10 has more expierence,
and it differs the weapons as well

No, levels don't determine skill past a point, which is why they're pretty pointless. Only being allowed more powerful weapons/armor after a certain level is stupid because Gunz isn't a MMORPG where higher levels are supposed to be able to kill all lower leveled players more easily.

Leveling is what keeps people playing the game. If there weren't any lvls I probably wouldn't be playin.

And may I ask you why you wouldn't be playing if there weren't any levels? "yay i get to unlock a submachine gun that does two more damage!"

Lvling is what makes the players play to get better weapons. W/o leveling this game would be like MoH.
Everyone would have the same equips and everyone would have the same weps... No fun....

Why aren't all weapons unlocked from the beginning? It would make earlier weapons useless, but then games should have an option to limit weapons to only a certain "power level". Why would it be bad if Gunz were like Medal of Honor? MoH has generally high reviews; leveling up is just a meaningless chore in a skill-based game.

Why would it be bad if everyone had the same equips? Everyone already uses different equipment; rifles, rocket launchers, machine guns, pistols, shotguns. Unless you mean different "strengths" of equipment, which I wrote about in the previous paragraph.

I disagree, levels make the game great. why u wanna just play and not be rewarded with anything

Why does everyone play ANY online first person shooter/RTS/other non-MMORPGs without leveling systems? It's because of the gameplay.

As in my first post, if the leveling system were changed to reflect a player's skill, then it'd be fine.

[StealhtFire]

lol wat wuz the point of posting that??? :xd:

[Dimeq]

Getting the point across :s

[MGSmaster101]

levels are somewhat important, just not as much as we wish

[ryouko]

Well, don't forget, if the person is less skilled then you, but with lvl 50 items, he still has big chance of killing you, nad you have big chance of killing him beacause your better, so it evens it out. Like most ppl can kill lvl 50s+ with a lvl 20-30(like me :))

[Dimeq]

Well, don't forget, if the person is less skilled then you, but with lvl 50 items, he still has big chance of killing you, nad you have big chance of killing him beacause your better, so it evens it out. Like most ppl can kill lvl 50s+ with a lvl 20-30(like me :))

Level 50 barely has an advantage over level 20-30 anyway D: But in my opinion there shouldn't be any advantage at all; Gunz is based on skill, and just because you play that much longer doesn't mean that you should get a better weapon, since that's not what it's about.

[SOLZ]

i say the levels need to stay, otherwise the game would be very boring amd pointless. many games are nothing withou levels, players want to show off and be the best so let them work for it.

[V3RG1L]

Levels in Gunz are pointless because Gunz is a skill-based game and not a MMORPG. Unless the level system were changed dramatically (get killed=lose one level, kill=gain a level; no maximum level), it only reflects how much time a player spent on the game and not on their skill.

Discuss.

what server u talking about

i know 2 privite server 1 kill = lvl up till lvl 50 and like 3 kills whne 70 = 50 kills

[Dimeq]

i say the levels need to stay, otherwise the game would be very boring amd pointless. many games are nothing withou levels, players want to show off and be the best so let them work for it.

Most of the attraction to Gunz is its replayability and depth, not being able to unlock special weapons or anything like that. Gunz is based on skill: how long you play shouldn't give you an advantage. Only MMORPGs rely on a leveling system because they force players to play for a long amount of time if they want to get some ability or be able to wear some item.

If a player wanted to show off, most of the time they wouldn't say their level, because it doesn't really tell much about how good they are at Gunz.

what server u talking about

i know 2 privite server 1 kill = lvl up till lvl 50 and like 3 kills whne 70 = 50 kills

I'm talking about ijji Gunz. The problem with the leveling system is that Gunz is not a MMORPG, and levels don't tell anything about the player except how long they've played. Raising rates wouldn't do much.

[BabyPiggy]

just stfu. we all noe this game is based on skill.. so very pointless thread

[Dagg3r_N00b]

Levels are for seperating the New players form the Old, Also to unlock new weapons and armour. The should make new weapons for high level players instead of premeium items.

[HeavenlyFlow]

Levels in Gunz are pointless because Gunz is a skill-based game and not a MMORPG. Unless the level system were changed dramatically (get killed=lose one level, kill=gain a level; no maximum level), it only reflects how much time a player spent on the game and not on their skill.

Discuss.

I bet you just died from a high level in a way you don't like.

[tailsy]

i dont really see the point ur trying to get across,

[BenBe]

Omg, think this out:

1. Gunz is a Skill-Based game.
2. Levels are added to create determination.
3. Weapon and Item restriction (Levels) are added to create determination.
4. Premium Items are added to create determination. (And to look good! :xd: )
5. When a player defeats you, you accquire a generally competitive nature... AND DETERMINATION!

DETERMINATION:

de-ter-min-ashion

Will to persist.


THAT IS ALL THIS GAME IS ABOUT! ACCQUIRING SKILL, ITEMS AND BEING ABLE TO BRAG! :=p:

I hoped this helps. Please ask me to post again if you have any Q's!

[tailsy]

if the game didnt change without lvl's then people will just get bored and quit

[Dimeq]

Levels are for seperating the New players form the Old, Also to unlock new weapons and armour. The should make new weapons for high level players instead of premeium items.

Beyond level 20 or so, they don't separate new from old or experienced from non-experienced, so as I said before, there should be only two types of channels for newbies and regular players. Because Gunz is based on skill, all weapons and armor should be unlocked from the beginning: a higher leveled player shouldn't gain an advantage because they've played longer. To keep lower leveled weapons from becoming useless in the case where the leveling system is drastically changed, there should be "tiers" of weapons and a game by game option to be able to change what weapons players in that room can use.

I bet you just died from a high level in a way you don't like.

I have a level 42 character and several friends' accounts with higher leveled characters.

i dont really see the point ur trying to get across,

Leveling should be changed to reflect skill, not time played.

1. Gunz is a Skill-Based game.

Yes...

2. Levels are added to create determination.

I assume that you mean that levels are added to keep players playing for a longer amount of time. But leveling up is not what Gunz is about, and not where its replayability comes from in the long term.

3. Weapon and Item restriction (Levels) are added to create determination.

Weapons and other item level restrictions are to reward players who spend a longer amount of time playing the game. Already wrote about this.

4. Premium Items are added to create determination. (And to look good! :xd: )

This doesn't really make any sense and doesn't have to do with leveling. Premium items were added for the publisher to make money :s

5. When a player defeats you, you accquire a generally competitive nature... AND DETERMINATION!

You mean ego? I don't see how that's good.

THAT IS ALL THIS GAME IS ABOUT! ACCQUIRING SKILL, ITEMS AND BEING ABLE TO BRAG! :=p:

You acquire skill, but experience/leveling isn't an accurate representation of it. You get items for playing a longer amount of time, but you shouldn't because Gunz is skill-based and everyone should play on equal ground regardless on how long they've played. Unless you've just started playing, you don't really brag about your level since it's almost meaningless.

if the game didnt change without lvl's then people will just get bored and quit

Replayability from Gunz is from its gameplay, not from the leveling system as I've said before. And the game doesn't really change with levels; you get some new armor, maybe a slightly more powerful weapon or you get to do a slightly harder quest.

[devilnflesh]

/care ¬_¬

You can unlock new stuff and harder quests etc with levels and levels make it more interesting.

Without levels many players would have quit long time ago.

Also you know that Lv50 is obviously better than 95-98% of Lv1-10 in beginner channel (those few percent are those with a higher Lv'ed character) so you can divide them into different channels

its actually /uncare said devilnflesh

[M1k3]

What ijji is trying to do with the level system is to get you to play as much as you can to unlock new weapons, armor, and special items. When you play longer, you'll get interested in prems, which equals $$$

[Dimeq]

What ijji is trying to do with the level system is to get you to play as much as you can to unlock new weapons, armor, and special items. When you play longer, you'll get interested in prems, which equals $$$

Pretty much, unfortunately. ijji only improves the game if it brings them money (there are many more updates to the cash shop or events involving spending money than general bugfixes and game improvements).

[Twilight光]

It's not like many FPS are that different...

[strikerbolt]

whee! a game design issue!
Let's see if I can possibly explain it (If I am incorrect somewhere, please do not hesitate to correct me)

According to my knowledge, GunZ was origionally going to be an Action-Adventure RPG (or something like that), but through the game design process it eventually became a Third Person Shooter with RPG elements. What then made it more popular was ironically programming bugs/glitches (that's a story for another time).

Anyway, from what I can determine from what you've said, Level denotes time played, not skill nor stats. You also believe in a simplified separation of skill level. What you suggested, however, is contradictory.
Basically, you want to slap all the newbs and decent players in one room and the advanced and expert players in another room. This doesn't really solve anything.
Level doesn't just determine time played (actually, it doesn't determine time at all). Level indirectly determines your skill level (Hence one reason why Ijji's been working so hard in stopping swappers). So if you have basic/advanced channel only, what determines if your good enough to advance?
Not only that, but Level also determines what weapons you can use. If this was eliminated, what's gonna separate this game from Soldier Front, or Counter-Strike? Styling and skill, you say? Okay, so who can I fight against until I learn the advanced basics? I know, I'll just go to the channel adjusted to my Low Level to fight against others also new to the game. Problem solved.
The level requirement also works in conjunture (to a point) with Weight. Weight also keeps the game well balanced. remove levels, and you create a lot more noobs.

To compare teh level drop from GunZ to another catastrophe, look at the Star Wars MMO. I have friends who used to think that was the best MMO ever. Then the Team behind that game made it so that you could immediatley do a lot of stuff (im not sure what it was) without the effort normally required behind it. What happened? The population of players in game (and in turn, the money being made off of it) suddenly dropped faster than the fan base for the 4kids version of One Piece. Said friends quit the game. Same thing would happen in GunZ, I predict.

In short, remove levels and you kill the drive behind it as well as the community. I love this game, but if that was removed I would quit because all my hard work up to this point had been for naught. I feel confident other would feel the same way.

[jeremywilms]

I disagree, levels make the game great. why u wanna just play and not be rewarded with anything :confused:

As a great gunz player(me) once said, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT DONT PLAY IT

Its like playing a game, and using cheats. You think "Wow this is going to be awsome infinite GP!" But within 15 minutes you never want to play the game again.

[Dimeq]

Anyway, from what I can determine from what you've said, Level denotes time played, not skill nor stats. You also believe in a simplified separation of skill level. What you suggested, however, is contradictory.
Basically, you want to slap all the newbs and decent players in one room and the advanced and expert players in another room. This doesn't really solve anything.
Level doesn't just determine time played (actually, it doesn't determine time at all). Level indirectly determines your skill level (Hence one reason why Ijji's been working so hard in stopping swappers). So if you have basic/advanced channel only, what determines if your good enough to advance?

For the beginner channel, I'd suggest for it to be from levels 1-20 with the current leveling system in order to get newbies acquainted with the game. But for the advanced channel, there should be a system where whenever anyone kills you, you lose exp (higher the level, the less exp and the opposite) and for there to be more exp for both killing and dying so leveling up/down doesn't take too long. It'd reflect skill more accurately (more kills than deaths=higher level), and it'd make swapping/powerleveling useless with equal kills, and one sided swapping would be worse because the team being killed would de-level and give less exp to the other player. As you said, level indirectly reflects your skill level, but it's not accurate enough to compare skill with.

Not only that, but Level also determines what weapons you can use. If this was eliminated, what's gonna separate this game from Soldier Front, or Counter-Strike? Styling and skill, you say? Okay, so who can I fight against until I learn the advanced basics? I know, I'll just go to the channel adjusted to my Low Level to fight against others also new to the game. Problem solved.
The level requirement also works in conjunture (to a point) with Weight. Weight also keeps the game well balanced. remove levels, and you create a lot more noobs.

When you start, you fight only in the beginner channel (maybe make it so there's a dialog that asks you in the lobby at level 20 if you want to go into the advanced channel). Weight balances the game by not letting you wear heavy weapons with better armor; if you don't know how to move around equipment to get the best stats, then you're a noob in the first place; it wouldn't make any new noobs.

To compare teh level drop from GunZ to another catastrophe, look at the Star Wars MMO. I have friends who used to think that was the best MMO ever. Then the Team behind that game made it so that you could immediatley do a lot of stuff (im not sure what it was) without the effort normally required behind it. What happened? The population of players in game (and in turn, the money being made off of it) suddenly dropped faster than the fan base for the 4kids version of One Piece. Said friends quit the game. Same thing would happen in GunZ, I predict.

Maybe make all the advantages for higher leveled weapons/armor aesthetic (with maybe a slight stat improvement over any previous armor) and buff all lower leveled weapons, and if you get to a weapon's level and de-level, you can still wear that weapon.

In short, remove levels and you kill the drive behind it as well as the community. I love this game, but if that was removed I would quit because all my hard work up to this point had been for naught. I feel confident other would feel the same way.

If ijji didn't have to chase down swappers/powerlevelers (maybe the new system takes care of it), then there could be more time spent to improve the game.

Also, AGHHHHH. When I hit preview post, it re-logged me in and reset my post so this is the second time writing this. I might've missed something in this post too since I rewrote it quickly.

[HeavenlyFlow]

I have a level 42 character and several friends' accounts with higher leveled characters.

It's funny how you admitted to sharing accounts.

[Sorrin]

The levels are important becuase you can get new weapons and play different kind of quest at a certain level.

[Dimeq]

It's funny how you admitted to sharing accounts.

Say that you have never gotten an account from anyone, ever.

The levels are important becuase you can get new weapons and play different kind of quest at a certain level.

Read through my responses in this topic.

[Dimeq]

bump to first page.

[MegamanExE]

bump to first page.

looking for something to bash? Face it though, everyone likes the leveling system now or at least almost everyone. Changing it would kill the game. Like Star Wars Galaxies. It was very popular, now hardly anyone plays it because of the NGE ( new game experiance ) the whole game was turned around and every place that use to be crowded became dead. This game would just die..... Seems to me your lvling system is more like a ranking system.

[Shellshok]

lvls makes how skilled they actually are not the stat points if u want stat points go to some RPG crap,
lvl 1 would get owned by lvl 10 because lvl 10 has more expierence,
and it differs the weapons as well

not really. depends on the level 10s equipment and skill....for all anyone knows the level 10 could have taken a year to get to that level...whereas the level one might have oodles of skill...(or a level 50 main) so...dont judge a book by its cover, judge it by its words

[frogger]

I like the levels its kinda like an achievement

[darkid300]

I like the levels its kinda like an achievement

O.O Why did frogger bump an old thread back up >.<

[Achmed]

I like the levels its kinda like an achievement

TF2 achievements suck. However sniping heavies will be entertaining.

[Pahoto]

Actually, leveling is only pointless after 65. This is how the makers of this game wanted it:

Low Levels - Low Weapons, Quest, and Armor

Mid Levels - Mid Weapons, Quest, and Armor

High Levels - High Weapons , Quest and Armor

and so on.

[Zakizan]

O.O
...I'm at a total loss for words here....
Why in the world would you want the levels to be removed? I mean, CMON, its what keeps me, and I know a lot of other people, striving to play more. When you get to lvl 29...You just HAVE to get to level 30 to get that awesome lvl 30 golden shotgun, and when you get it, you feel a sence of self-achievement. If you just had that amazing uber golden shotgun right off, then what would be the point of having it, if you knew you didn't work for it.

[ugotowned 0]

hhmmm i think this guy is a lvl 10 that get pwned by lvls 50. cuz of the weps.

[Achmed]

O.O
...I'm at a total loss for words here....
Why in the world would you want the levels to be removed? I mean, CMON, its what keeps me, and I know a lot of other people, striving to play more. When you get to lvl 29...You just HAVE to get to level 30 to get that awesome lvl 30 golden shotgun, and when you get it, you feel a sence of self-achievement. If you just had that amazing uber golden shotgun right off, then what would be the point of having it, if you knew you didn't work for it.

Your supposed to feel good when you gain skill, not get a fancy toy.

[Occulus]

umm yeah in Ijji, level doesnt mean fcuk. but go to DR GunZ and they use the ring system, and the guns, level is all about wut it means. Staff member swords kill oyu ijn 1 hit. lol'd

so chyea, here level isnt an issue

[Tijne]

My only comments are to the first post.. *coughreading5pagesdoesnotsuitme,andthere'sa60%cha nceeverythingwentofftopic,sowhateverxDcough*

Levels in Gunz are pointless because Gunz is a skill-based game and not a MMORPG. Unless the level system were changed dramatically (get killed=lose one level, kill=gain a level; no maximum level), it only reflects how much time a player spent on the game and not on their skill.

Discuss.

There are quite a lot of things to prove in this, so I'll take it piece by piece!




I) Levels are Not Pointless

A) Levels regulate your maximum possible armor
B) Levels regulate your maximum possible damage, per weapon type.
C) Levels regulate in what channels you can play
D) Levels regulate in what maps you can play
E) Levels give other players an idea of how skilled you are
F) Levels regulate how little/much experience/bounty you recieve.
G) Levels regulate whether you lose experience or not whether you suicide, or are killed.
H) Levels control who can create a clan.
I) Levels regulate the possible difficulties of Quest Mode
J) Levels give players an idea of how much you've played the game (Time Spent)
K) Levels regulate what possible weapons you can use.




II) GunZ is NOTonly a skill based game.

A) An element of randomness is involved when any gun with less than perfect accurcacy is fired.
B) The entire concept of Ping, because it cannot be remained stable, holds a small luck-based element.
C) Green Boxes, Pink Boxes, Blue Boxes, are purely random.
D) Items recieved from Quest Mode are randomized. [Events are suppose to be as well, but this has yet to be implemented.]
E) Critical Ratio is also random.
F) Certain Server/Game events contain random aspects.




III) MMORPG's are, to an extent, skill-based games.

A) Ability to solve/complete puzzles/quests.
B) Ability to socially interact with others, for help, friendship, guilds, etc..
C) Ability to work well together, as a team.
D) Ability to know what to do, when do to it, during a fight.
E) Ability to remember locations/directions, and find your way around.
F) Ability to fight, and win, another player of equal/higher level.

GunZ has many similar elements in certain types of gameplay.




IV) GunZ can be considered an MMORPG

A) It is a Massive, Multiplayer, Online Game. 'Role Playing' is included, with a history, details, and a 'GunZy' element, -- but is normally tossed aside by players and considered optional (Like most standard MMORPG)
B) A large number of players interact with one another in a virtual world.
C) We have a semi-tradional, matrix like theme, with an element of magic and monsters. (Similar to some Final Fantasy games), like most other MMORPGs.
D) There is an extensive chat system, and social network ability (friends list, clan, xfire).
E) Each character you possess has an individual level and alias independant of the others.




V) Levels Can, and Do to an extent reflect skill.

While players may learn at different rates, and have a maximum capacity to grown and learn based on their own styles, the more someone plays (time spent), the generally better they are.

When a level 5, with a main of level 60 is seen to act like a level 60, beating level 30s two at a time, it is inclined to ask that level 5 "What's your main's level?" -- Being level 5 when you've really spent over a month in the game is generally not a good reflection of time spent in the game anyways, so your argument fails in this area regardless. It is also to be noted that the victory of the level 5 would both be easier, and stronger (aka, able to beat three level 30s at once) if they were on the main character of level 60.


In addition, if there was another level 60 fighting that level 5, even if the level 5 was slightly more skilled, or even more skilled by a comparable amount, the level 60 would generally win due to the definite extra boost of strength given by the level-character they are playing on.


Assuming we're not playing GunZ.. -- if I was to join a new MMORPG I've never played before and get to level 10 -- I would believe it would take me less time, if I was to start another new character and do it all over. ~ thus I would be more skilled, more knowledgable, and more experience, even if we were to believe my above statements to be false about MMORPGs requiring skill.




VI) There are deviants from the norm.

Unfortunetly, yes, there are a grey area --
Someone who's Main is lost, or is playing a second/third/fourth/etc.. time, or has come from another GunZ will undoubtedly have a lower level than they would have otherwise [though with their added skill, leveling up will be faster. ], or someone who focused on training when they should have been leveling up... -- There are many factors to affect your level... But like said, these players levels do [I]not even reflect their time spent playing, so, in these case, your argument is invalid as well.

The main grey area which is relevant to this discussion are levels of people whom have time spent at a different than average relationship to their skill. In other words, people with equal, or about equal amounts of play time but with majorly different skills and/or levels. The only contributing factors to this are learning speeds and willingness to learn.
-- This is a difference gap between the kid that researches all possible techniques, practices everything, reads everything, asks people for advice/help, tries everything, learns quickly, puts together smart strategies and ideas ahead of time, and the person who played for two years, but still never bothered to even start butterflying (or did try, but never got the hang of it).


In case you couldn't draw that connection, the above paragraph was describing extremes of the spectrum, the most 'grey areas'. The majority of players -- most average people will have a skill that is reflected by their level, or be subject to the first paragraph which is not relative to the discussion based on your own words.




VII. In Conclusion
A) Levels have many, many effects on the game.
B) GunZ is not entirely skill based, regardless of level benefits/disadvantages.
C) Most MMORPG's have a skill based element.
D) GunZ can be considered an MMORPG.
E) Levels can, 4 times out of 5, reflect skill.
F) There are always situations which diverge from the norm. (These are the only situation where people generally question the norm.)
G) I am too lazy to read replys, read this over for grammatical mistakes/clarity, etc..etc.. Maybe I will, but don't count on it. xD Either way, I doubt there's anymore I can say on the matter. ^^;

[frogger]

TF2 achievements suck. However sniping heavies will be entertaining.

I was refering to achievements to the xbox 360 games, meh i could care less about achievements but tf2 i have to care to get new weapons lol

[frogger]

My only comments are to the first post.. *coughreading5pagesdoesnotsuitme,andthere'sa60%cha nceeverythingwentofftopic,sowhateverxDcough*



There are quite a lot of things to prove in this, so I'll take it piece by piece!




I) Levels are Not Pointless

A) Levels regulate your maximum possible armor
B) Levels regulate your maximum possible damage, per weapon type.
C) Levels regulate in what channels you can play
D) Levels regulate in what maps you can play
E) Levels give other players an idea of how skilled you are
F) Levels regulate how little/much experience/bounty you recieve.
G) Levels regulate whether you lose experience or not whether you suicide, or are killed.
H) Levels control who can create a clan.
I) Levels regulate the possible difficulties of Quest Mode
J) Levels give players an idea of how much you've played the game (Time Spent)
K) Levels regulate what possible weapons you can use.




II) GunZ is NOTonly a skill based game.

A) An element of randomness is involved when any gun with less than perfect accurcacy is fired.
B) The entire concept of Ping, because it cannot be remained stable, holds a small luck-based element.
C) Green Boxes, Pink Boxes, Blue Boxes, are purely random.
D) Items recieved from Quest Mode are randomized. [Events are suppose to be as well, but this has yet to be implemented.]
E) Critical Ratio is also random.
F) Certain Server/Game events contain random aspects.




III) MMORPG's are, to an extent, skill-based games.

A) Ability to solve/complete puzzles/quests.
B) Ability to socially interact with others, for help, friendship, guilds, etc..
C) Ability to work well together, as a team.
D) Ability to know what to do, when do to it, during a fight.
E) Ability to remember locations/directions, and find your way around.
F) Ability to fight, and win, another player of equal/higher level.

GunZ has many similar elements in certain types of gameplay.




IV) GunZ can be considered an MMORPG

A) It is a Massive, Multiplayer, Online Game. 'Role Playing' is included, with a history, details, and a 'GunZy' element, -- but is normally tossed aside by players and considered optional (Like most standard MMORPG)
B) A large number of players interact with one another in a virtual world.
C) We have a semi-tradional, matrix like theme, with an element of magic and monsters. (Similar to some Final Fantasy games), like most other MMORPGs.
D) There is an extensive chat system, and social network ability (friends list, clan, xfire).
E) Each character you possess has an individual level and alias independant of the others.




V) Levels Can, and Do to an extent reflect skill.

While players may learn at different rates, and have a maximum capacity to grown and learn based on their own styles, the more someone plays (time spent), the generally better they are.

When a level 5, with a main of level 60 is seen to act like a level 60, beating level 30s two at a time, it is inclined to ask that level 5 "What's your main's level?" -- Being level 5 when you've really spent over a month in the game is generally not a good reflection of time spent in the game anyways, so your argument fails in this area regardless. It is also to be noted that the victory of the level 5 would both be easier, and stronger (aka, able to beat three level 30s at once) if they were on the main character of level 60.


In addition, if there was another level 60 fighting that level 5, even if the level 5 was slightly more skilled, or even more skilled by a comparable amount, the level 60 would generally win due to the definite extra boost of strength given by the level-character they are playing on.


Assuming we're not playing GunZ.. -- if I was to join a new MMORPG I've never played before and get to level 10 -- I would believe it would take me less time, if I was to start another new character and do it all over. ~ thus I would be more skilled, more knowledgable, and more experience, even if we were to believe my above statements to be false about MMORPGs requiring skill.




VI) There are deviants from the norm.

Unfortunetly, yes, there are a grey area --
Someone who's Main is lost, or is playing a second/third/fourth/etc.. time, or has come from another GunZ will undoubtedly have a lower level than they would have otherwise [though with their added skill, leveling up will be faster. ], or someone who focused on training when they should have been leveling up... -- There are many factors to affect your level... But like said, these players levels do [I]not even reflect their time spent playing, so, in these case, your argument is invalid as well.

The main grey area which is relevant to this discussion are levels of people whom have time spent at a different than average relationship to their skill. In other words, people with equal, or about equal amounts of play time but with majorly different skills and/or levels. The only contributing factors to this are learning speeds and willingness to learn.
-- This is a difference gap between the kid that researches all possible techniques, practices everything, reads everything, asks people for advice/help, tries everything, learns quickly, puts together smart strategies and ideas ahead of time, and the person who played for two years, but still never bothered to even start butterflying (or did try, but never got the hang of it).


In case you couldn't draw that connection, the above paragraph was describing extremes of the spectrum, the most 'grey areas'. The majority of players -- most average people will have a skill that is reflected by their level, or be subject to the first paragraph which is not relative to the discussion based on your own words.




VII. In Conclusion
A) Levels have many, many effects on the game.
B) GunZ is not entirely skill based, regardless of level benefits/disadvantages.
C) Most MMORPG's have a skill based element.
D) GunZ can be considered an MMORPG.
E) Levels can, 4 times out of 5, reflect skill.
F) There are always situations which diverge from the norm. (These are the only situation where people generally question the norm.)
G) I am too lazy to read replys, read this over for grammatical mistakes/clarity, etc..etc.. Maybe I will, but don't count on it. xD Either way, I doubt there's anymore I can say on the matter. ^^;

You are the most THUR-O explanation master ive ever seen in one post on any forum

[KakashiHatake103]

okay, i read so many of these posts and haven't seen one that agrees with this guy. everyone likes having lvls so you and this thread= EPIC PHAIL

[NOTaKitten]

You know what I find fun?
Trolling people on my character, glwithclan.

Level 13 playing naked with a rusty, raging and dropping silly level 60 kids who think that I have no right to talk to them because they can kill simple npcs.

or if i'm on cw na, standing still and blocking with a military with mudkip , making them cry. ahahahahah, silly SCRUBsSss

wow they're so gud lern me.

+1

[ugotowned 0]

They do matter, cuz old players should have like an advantage whit newbies whit better weps, and armour... and it will be boring if every1 gives the same exp.

[blue9700]

hmm..
(dun kill me)
i think lvl are not so important
more lvls=more respect
when im lvl 50 i have nothing to do because i have no g-conis and all stuff
my items are only lvl 50 sword,lvl 40 cloths and some breakers,spray and .........
(p.s:dun kill me)

[frogger]

lol i think u were in a dm with me yesterday on mudkip

[wadesy2k7]

hmm..
(dun kill me)
i think lvl are not so important
more lvls=more respect
when im lvl 50 i have nothing to do because i have no g-conis and all stuff
my items are only lvl 50 sword,lvl 40 cloths and some breakers,spray and .........
(p.s:dun kill me)

*Pulls knife out of back*

Now that is over and done with, i would like to input my feelings:

To the maker of this thread: Go hide under a rock.
To people who say a level 50 will kill a level 1: I beg to differ.

Awesome thread! :thumbsup:

[KakashiHatake103]

You know what I find fun?
Trolling people on my character, glwithclan.

Level 13 playing naked with a rusty, raging and dropping silly level 60 kids who think that I have no right to talk to them because they can kill simple npcs.

or if i'm on cw na, standing still and blocking with a military with mudkip , making them cry. ahahahahah, silly SCRUBsSss

wow they're so gud lern me.

+1

Too bad you fail to mention that the lvl 13 is your alt. and your main is probably just as high as the people you kill.

[NOTaKitten]

Too bad you fail to mention that the lvl 13 is your alt. and your main is probably just as high as the people you kill.

My main's level 50.
The people I kill are level 60 and 70. That's quite a bit of difference.

If level matters to the extent where equipment > skill, then why can I win on my level 13?
OH EZ OH EZ OH EZ OH EZ OHEOHZOHOERHDHOEHOZHOEHHA OLDIKA

+1

[KakashiHatake103]

Only luck is > Then Skill. Nothing else. But you can't obtain luckyness so Skill is the best. Don't matter what lvl you are, its just to divide up gunz. Anyways, once you reach lvl 50, you should be at the pinacle of your GunZ skill level. By then you should know all kstyle and dstyle.

[NOTaKitten]

Only luck is > Then Skill. Nothing else. But you can't obtain luckyness so Skill is the best. Don't matter what lvl you are, its just to divide up gunz. Anyways, once you reach lvl 50, you should be at the pinacle of your GunZ skill level. By then you should know all kstyle and dstyle.

My point wasn't addressed towards you though.
My point was that, addressing the people who believed that level > everything else, that skill has a higher effect than level. However, level does help a bit, I can't deny that.

And yet, I can't agree with you at the level 50 part.
I'm still learning things at level 50 and above. Lots of things, actually.
Sure, one may know all the moves, but no one can perfect them to the level where you've mastered a style.

[agresfranck]

=.=" =.="